Philosophy

The Birth of Tragedy

The Birth of Tragedy

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  • Create Date：2021-04-09 10:52:05
  • Update Date：2025-09-06
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  • Author：Friedrich Nietzsche
  • ISBN：0140433392
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Summary

A compelling argument for the necessity for art in life， Nietzsche's first book is fuelled by his enthusiasms for Greek tragedy， for the philosophy of Schopenhauer and for the music of Wagner， to whom this work was dedicated。 Nietzsche outlined a distinction between its two central forces: the Apolline， representing beauty and order， and the Dionysiac， a primal or ecstatic reaction to the sublime。 He believed the combination of these states produced the highest forms of music and tragic drama， which not only reveal the truth about suffering in life， but also provide a consolation for it。 Impassioned and exhilarating in its conviction， The Birth of Tragedy has become a key text in European culture and in literary criticism。

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Reviews

Sef99 ，

"Ecco che irrompe la nuova forma di conoscenza， la conoscenza tragica， la quale， per poter essere sopportata， ha bisogno dell’arte come protezione e rimedio。" "Ecco che irrompe la nuova forma di conoscenza， la conoscenza tragica， la quale， per poter essere sopportata， ha bisogno dell’arte come protezione e rimedio。" 。。。more

Nicholas Morrell ，

This man was much smarter than me， however， what's more important to observe about this book is that he also had a lot more BALLS than me， specifically enough balls to attack the granddaddy of all granddaddies of intellectual giants， my main man， Socrates。 While I admire the boldness and the enthusiasm， the points he makes （heavily in regards to the concept of Apollo vs Dionysus） to support his case that the "demonic Socrates" imprisoned people's minds by establishing the standard of objective m This man was much smarter than me， however， what's more important to observe about this book is that he also had a lot more BALLS than me， specifically enough balls to attack the granddaddy of all granddaddies of intellectual giants， my main man， Socrates。 While I admire the boldness and the enthusiasm， the points he makes （heavily in regards to the concept of Apollo vs Dionysus） to support his case that the "demonic Socrates" imprisoned people's minds by establishing the standard of objective morality/ ruth in ethics， art， philosophy and beyond， seem to me a lack of humility and recognition of one's own mortal inability to just rewrite the laws of nature and physics to fit whatever pleases him personally。 At least， that's what I got out of it， and so far it's basically what I get out of Nietzsche in general， but I may just be missing the point。 Everybody misinterprets Nietzsche according to， well， basically everybody， right？ But hey， at least I'm not the one locked up in a mental institution for eleven years。 。。。more

Savvina ，

Even as I am intrigued by Nietzsche I tend to have some problems with his ideas and his writing style。 So I'm going to start with the cons before I get to the pros。Cons:It was at times needlessly metaphorical， repetitive and grandiose which I guess is just Nietzsche’s style。 But it definitely makes his interesting ideas difficult to swallow when they are wrapped in such an irritating package。There are times where he gets to the nub of an issue he is trying to present so eloquently that it's bril Even as I am intrigued by Nietzsche I tend to have some problems with his ideas and his writing style。 So I'm going to start with the cons before I get to the pros。Cons:It was at times needlessly metaphorical， repetitive and grandiose which I guess is just Nietzsche’s style。 But it definitely makes his interesting ideas difficult to swallow when they are wrapped in such an irritating package。There are times where he gets to the nub of an issue he is trying to present so eloquently that it's brilliant。 Other times， he paints in broad strokes appraising and devaluing everything and anything during the same paragraph。 In those times， he presents his uncertainty with such confidence that one may read this and then might believe that Nietzsche always knew what he was talking about。 It seems that what he basically knew was that Euripides was stupid and Wagner was great and so he needed to build a theory as to why the above is true。 And here lies the biggest weakness that I have noticed with him as an author thus far。 Nietzsche has a conclusion he believes in and only afterwards does he build his entire argument。 The idea he presents allows no nuance or grey areas just his own conclusion。 It is strange how a man so absolute can still manage to write in a confusing way。Something of note:As far as I am aware Nietzsche was not in fact a Nazi， he would've opposed his works being used by Hitler and he hated anti-Semitism。 But it would be a lie to say that he was not a nationalist， at least in this work。 I can't speak for all of his works as he was known to be contradictory。 He very clearly talks about the degeneration of culture （thought granted he does not say this happened due to multiculturalism） and he names Germany as its savior。 Whether that’s German philosophy or German music。 He does make a few points towards this argument （comparing France with Germany for example） but he does not provide that much evidence。 I could just say this is a product of the times， as most people tended to exalt their homeland。 He also makes a point of saying something that a "Defender of the West" would say nowadays。 That Ancient Greece is da best and we'll never reach those heights of civilization。 In fact the Dionysian （aka the more "primitive" and raw aspect of art）， according to him， did not truly become noble or noteworthy until it merged with Ancient Greek intellect。 The implication is obvious。 It's savage and meaningless when "barbaric" countries did it but noble and beautiful when the descendants of the West did it。 I am not going to completely judge him by today's standards but I would be weary of someone who is a fan of these parts in particular。Pros:Nonetheless I did enjoy a lot of things in this book。 When it works it really works。 In fact despite my complaints seeming to be big， I enjoyed it for the most part。 The borderline sensual language he uses to talk about Athenian tragedy and the way one experiences art is almost moving。 I would actually recommend that any artist should at least have an idea of what Nietzsche is talking about here。 His explanation of the Dionysian and Apollonian （so long as you remember that these words are metaphors for bigger concepts）， his argument as to why too much rationality can kill art， his criticism of art that poses as authentic but is actually shallow are all really interesting。 All in all he seems to be making a case for art。 He is an ardent defender of it and its continued survival。 You don't have to agree with him but you have to admit he makes you think。 His arguments may at times be confused but you have to admit he believes in them wholeheartedly。 。。。more

Haakon Andresen ，

One of the worst books I have ever read。 Some of his ideas are interesting， but the structure of the arguments and the text on a technical level are absolutely horrible。 Long and convoluted sentences that try to build equally convoluted arguments。 Many of the books core points rely on observations that the author just poses as truth， without any explanation or arguments for it。 You know you are reading a bad book when several central points are made by stating that it must be obvious。If you are One of the worst books I have ever read。 Some of his ideas are interesting， but the structure of the arguments and the text on a technical level are absolutely horrible。 Long and convoluted sentences that try to build equally convoluted arguments。 Many of the books core points rely on observations that the author just poses as truth， without any explanation or arguments for it。 You know you are reading a bad book when several central points are made by stating that it must be obvious。If you are interested in Nietzsche the book might be worth reading， but if you want to learn or be provoked to thought then this is not the book for you。 Horrible read。 。。。more

Paul Spence ，

This is Nietzsche's first book: it contains the thoughts of this great writer and thinker， who had a formative influence on Heidegger and through him Derrida， the two greatest post-Nietzschean philosophers。 Nietzsche's great theme is the infinite possibility opened up by Greek culture in 6th century B。C。， in the time of Heraclitus and the birth of tragedy-the culture that spawned not only democracy and science but which， like a brood of many eggs only some of which have hatched （or quantum possi This is Nietzsche's first book: it contains the thoughts of this great writer and thinker， who had a formative influence on Heidegger and through him Derrida， the two greatest post-Nietzschean philosophers。 Nietzsche's great theme is the infinite possibility opened up by Greek culture in 6th century B。C。， in the time of Heraclitus and the birth of tragedy-the culture that spawned not only democracy and science but which， like a brood of many eggs only some of which have hatched （or quantum possibility before measurement "collapses" the wave function into reality）-much more besides--the culture beside whose tragedic productions （by Aeschylus and Sophocles， not Euripedes， whom Nietzsche shows lost touch with the essence of tragedy） modern cultural productions not only do not measure up， but often seem at best， as Nietzsche says， like a "caricature。" The loss of art traced by Nietzsche is itself-well， not tragic， no-less than tragic: sad let us say。 Not only a highly creative artist-like philosopher， but a multilingual philologist who read ancient Greek in the original， Nietzsche beams his laser-like analysis with astounding clarity into this lost realm of possibility。 It is as if he stuck a bookmark into the Tome of Time， showing us the very best part of an otherwise often dry and rather bad （and perhaps overly long！） book of which we collectively are the author， called Culture。 What is crucial to emphasise in B of T is Nietzsche's conclusion （or assumption） that （in its most famous line） "existence is only justified as an aesthetic phenomenon。" Thus ancient Greek tragedy is not just a random subject， or one art form among others。 It is the aesthetic experience par excellence， the greatest overcoming of the perils of existence into a worthy production of art humans ever developed。 Nietzsche links the success of Aeschylean and Sophoclean tragedy to the brief fruitful intercourse （like that between men and women， which keeps new people coming despite often-fractious sexual relationships） between two aesthetic strains。 One he identifies with the Greek messenger god of the sun， Apollo， the other with the dismembered god of wine， Dionysus。 Dionysus also is not one god among others。 Rather， it was to him that all the （originally religious） tragedies were devoted and， Nietzsche tells us， when other actors appeared on the sacred precursor to the Greek stage they were not to be taken as realistic but as avatars， idealised other versions， of Dionysus。 Now the most crucial thing to realise about Dionysus is that "he" is split into pieces and his split pieces represent the fundamental， and contradictory， fact of the universe: that although all is one （to borrow a philosophical truism） this One is split into many。 This primordial splitting （cf。 Heidegger's distinction between individual beings and Being） is， according to Nietzsche， regarded by the ancient Greeks as itself the ur-source of human suffering。 From Dionysus's tears came mankind， from his smile the gods。 Now Nietzsche says that the Apollonian aesthetic strain manifests in the clarity of dreams-which show discrete-although ultimately illusory-images。 These images are similar to those that appear before the chorus （crucial to tragedy but dispensed with by Euripides）， and before the spectators， in the form of the actors of the tragic spectacle。 Thus the tragic spectacle displayed shows itself to be a dreamlike illusion of the culture， not a representation of reality per se。 Just as， after we stare at the sun， we see spots before our eyes so， Nietzsche says， after we stare into the abyss we see the tragedy with its chorus and ideal human characters。 The Dionysian element Nietzsche identifies with drunkenness and dissolution， the opposite of the clarity of dream imagery， made public on the Greek stage。 The Dionysian in a sense represents the One， or the movement from the individual （seen a la Schopenhauer and Vedic metaphysics as a Mayan illusion of universe that "I"s itself） back to the One; the Apollonian the illusory clarity of the skin-encapsulated individual。 One of the most fascinating things about Nietzsche's exquisitely crafted analysis is the way it shows science， no less than Euripides， to be motivated by Socrates' false humility and dreams of total knowledge。 "Who is this demigod？" Nietzsche asks of Socrates-whose reign of reasonableness， passed on to Plato， Aristotle， and the Church scholastics-defines much of the modern world。 Socrates created the secular tradition， raising knowledge over aesthetics and giving mysticism a bad name。 Nietzsche points out that Plato burnt his plays after coming into contact with his teacher-and that the compromise， the Platonic dialogues， were in fact the prototype of a new， Socratized art form-the novel。 Thus， startlingly Nietzsche suggests the novel itself is a debased form of art-a Euripideanized， Socratized attempt to make the primal aesthetic experience more representative， reasonable， and realistic。 Euripedes （he later recanted， but his influence went on） dispensed with the tragic core of stagecraft， and today we accept that drama is about individual characters in all their oddity and imperfections-rammed at us unremittingly with the hegemony of plot and wordy deus ex machina explanations in the aesthetically poisonous， hyper-rationalistic aftermath of Euripides's Socratic capitulations。 In sum， today we have all but forgotten the Dionysian origins of acting-more real than realism-which originally was centered around not fleeting emotions and empathy， but the central cosmological fact of the individuals tragic separation from the All。 。。。more

Salem ，

I'M DDDDDOOOOONNEEEE I'M DDDDDOOOOONNEEEE 。。。more

Gay Gerbil ，

I came to this book， my first of Nietzsche， briefly after reading Camille Paglia's Sexual Personae 。 Within the first few pages I realized I was in for a much different experience。 While Paglia borrows and expands the distinction between the Apollonian and Dionysian， Nietzsche's original work centers mainly on these two Olympian forces as at it pertains to Greek tragedy。Tracing tragedies origins in near eastern ritual and myth， Nietzsche goes on to develop the hypothesis that Greek tragedy repre I came to this book， my first of Nietzsche， briefly after reading Camille Paglia's Sexual Personae 。 Within the first few pages I realized I was in for a much different experience。 While Paglia borrows and expands the distinction between the Apollonian and Dionysian， Nietzsche's original work centers mainly on these two Olympian forces as at it pertains to Greek tragedy。Tracing tragedies origins in near eastern ritual and myth， Nietzsche goes on to develop the hypothesis that Greek tragedy represented the confluence of the Apollonian， the drive to give form， and the Dionysian， which represents chaotic boundless nature。 In his analysis of these drives， Nietzsche blames the rise of the Socratic tendency of man for tragedies demise， following the plays of Euripedes。 Nietzsche himself disowned the last third of the essay， but I found it to be a highlight。 Towards the end we get a more dramatic Nietzsche， as he fixes his gaze on the meaning of art in the context of increasingly mythless civilization。 The prose here becomes more flowery and triumphal， no doubt spurred on by his discussion of music and Wagners influence。 There is also some stuff here about Wagner apparently awakening the German spirit， which I don't know much about but would be interested to learn more。Anyone interested in aesthetics and the metaphysics of art should read this。 Paglia fans as well， gives some nice context to her work。 。。。more

André Jan ，

This book convinced me that Dionysus was underpowered in the Zeus city building games。

Harry Gardner ，

This review has been hidden because it contains spoilers。 To view it， click here。 Provocative， intriguing， mostly bunk （at least in its consistently swatting critique with denigration of those 'uninitiated in tragedy' and it as a historical analysis of Greek tragedy）， but very much worth a read。 The duality of art in the Apolline aspect of art--the rational， individuating， visual， illusory--compared with the Dionysiac aspect of art--the orgiastic， overwhelming， ego-consuming--is quite neat。 The critique of science and its limits is an interesting one， although very much the " Provocative， intriguing， mostly bunk （at least in its consistently swatting critique with denigration of those 'uninitiated in tragedy' and it as a historical analysis of Greek tragedy）， but very much worth a read。 The duality of art in the Apolline aspect of art--the rational， individuating， visual， illusory--compared with the Dionysiac aspect of art--the orgiastic， overwhelming， ego-consuming--is quite neat。 The critique of science and its limits is an interesting one， although very much the "it cannot explain everything， and therefore cannot explain anything" type， which does not limit his theory of art as it does not contend to require rational justification。 "Only as an aesthetic phenomenon that existence and the world are eternally justified"。 。。。more

mohab samir ，

يبدو ان نيتشة فى شبابه كان مشغولا بقضية الثقافة اكثر مما سواها ويبدو انه بذلك قد اراد تخطى مجرد الاهتمام التربوى الموروث من عصر التنوير بل ومن عصر النهضة 。 وربما يهتم هنا فى مولد التراجيديا بأهم العوامل الجدلية فى تطور الثقافة والذى ربما يكون عبر تقهقرها أحيانا ، كما اهتم فى كتابه شوبنهاور مربيا ان يحدد معنى الثقافة وغايتها المطلقة لا النسبية اى المفهوم الفلسفى للثقافة خارج اطار الزمن والمكان 。ان العلم والفن هما ظاهرتين حقيقتين بالنسبة للإنسان وقد وجدا منذ وجوده وتطورا بتطوره 。 ودرجة تطورهما تمث يبدو ان نيتشة فى شبابه كان مشغولا بقضية الثقافة اكثر مما سواها ويبدو انه بذلك قد اراد تخطى مجرد الاهتمام التربوى الموروث من عصر التنوير بل ومن عصر النهضة 。 وربما يهتم هنا فى مولد التراجيديا بأهم العوامل الجدلية فى تطور الثقافة والذى ربما يكون عبر تقهقرها أحيانا ، كما اهتم فى كتابه شوبنهاور مربيا ان يحدد معنى الثقافة وغايتها المطلقة لا النسبية اى المفهوم الفلسفى للثقافة خارج اطار الزمن والمكان 。ان العلم والفن هما ظاهرتين حقيقتين بالنسبة للإنسان وقد وجدا منذ وجوده وتطورا بتطوره 。 ودرجة تطورهما تمثل مدى تطور ثقافته اى تطور ذاتيته 。 وتحقق حريته 。ولكن لابد للفن فى بداياته ان يكون لا واقعيا ولا علميا ولكنه يبدو عمليا فى الحياة حيث يتخذ ثوب الميثولوجيا التى تفتقر الى العلمية والمادية ولكنه لا يخلو من الروحانية والخيال 。 وهو عملي لأنه يعضد الانسان فى كفاحه ويستر جهله ويعضد عجزه ويجبر انكساره 。 ويتطور هذا الفن رغم قيود الميثولوجيا التى تحيط بعنقه ويسمو عن مجرد تجسيد الالهة الى الشعر الملحمى الذى يعلل وجودها ويسرد بطولاتها ومآسيها بما تحمله من مغزى ورمز مرورا بالشعر الغنائى والدراما وصولا الى الاندماج بالموسيقى التى يمكن ان تسمى فى نشأتها كما يرتأى نيتشه فنا ديونيسيا اى كليا وروحانيا وبعيدا عن الفردانية - وشعبيا من منظور اجتماعي - فى مقابل الفن الأبولونى - نسبة الى ابولو - الذى يمثل التجسد والظهور والفردانية （او الارستقراطية ） 。 والذى يتمثل فى النحت مثلا أو الشعر الملحمى كأشعار هوميروس وهزيود والذى سيتطور ويندمج مع الموسيقى فى المسرح التراجيدى والذى سيحتوى عدة عوامل متناقضة كالموسيقى فى وجه الكلمة والكورس الغنائى فى وجه البطل الملحمى الفرد 。 لذا يعد نيتشة مولد التراجيديا من رحم الموسيقى وهو ما كان عليه عنوان الكتاب قبل نشره فالكلمة المغناة تحدد المعنى اللامتحدد المتمثل فى الموسيقى الانفعالية والممثلة للإرادة 。 ويتماهى كلاهما فى وحدة تطبع أثرها الخاص فى المتلقى 。ويجد نيتشة نفسه هنا فى المرحلة الفنية الحاسمة فى تاريخ البشرية حيث انه أولا يمضى تطور الفن فى صراع جدلى بين العاملى الديونيسى والعامل الأوبولونى ثانيا حيث يبين نيتشة اللحظة المفصلية التى حدثت بتأثير سقراط وتلاميذه والتى اسقطت فن التراجيديا اليونانى الفن الذى يعد احد أعظم اشكال الفن فى التاريخ الانسانى 。 فقد ازاحت النظرة العلمية والمنطقية لسقراط النظرة الميثولوجية للوجود عموما وللفن بشكل خاص ، وارتأت ان امل الانسان العاجز وخلاصه لا يوجد الا بتقدمه المعرفى وتطور طرق تفكيره وطبيعة افكاره 。 لا بالاستناد على المصادرات التى تطرح على الانسان من المشاكل اكثر مما تحل وتعيق نموه وتطوره الحضارى -اذا تمادى فى الاعتماد عليها أطول من مدى ضرورتها - أكثر من كونها معينا له على عجزه ومخاوفه وآلامه بل انها غالبا ما تزيد من حدة هذه المخاوف والالام 。 وكانت حياة سقراط حتى نهايتها مشهدا فنيا لا مثيل له ولحظة سامية فى تاريخ الجنس البشرى حيث بدأ الانسان فى مواجهة ذاته والتعرف عليها فى حقيقتها 。وبذلك ساهم سقراط والأفلاطونيون بتحرير العلم الذى هو الحكمة فى نظرهم والفن على السواء من ربقة الميثولوجيا وبالتالى بدأت حقبة يندمج فيها الفن والعلم فى وحدة جديدة تحقق التناغم والتناسب والمنطقية - على عكس ما كان عليه الحال - وتتكشف فيها علاقاتهما المتبادلة وجوديا التى تجعل كل منهما مكملاً للاخر 。وخلاصة يحاول نيتشة تصوير الفن كمرآة للثقافة كما يبين الجدل الدائر بينهما فى مسيرة نموهما جنبا الى جنب مع تصوير نمو الفنون اليونانية على الاخص كمرحلة حاسمة فى التاريخ البشرى وكبداية واضحة للصراع بين العامل الديونيسى الموسيقى الكلى بروحانيته والعامل الأبولى المجسد للفردية بعبقريتها ، الصراع الذى يبلغ قمته فى التراجيديا الاغريقية والذى يتصل حتى الى الموسيقى والاوبرا الالمانية فى عصر نيتشة ولكن برؤية مخالفة للرؤية اليونانية التى كانت ترى فى الموسيقى خادما طيعا للشعر فى حين تسمو الموسيقى عن الكلمة فى الثقافة الحديثة كما تسمو العاطفة فى عمقها عن الكلمة المجردة التى تعبر عنها ، وعن محاولة منطقة وعقلنة هذا الشعور 。 كما كان اليونانيون يتفهمون نظرتهم لذاتهم وللكون وهى النظرة التى منحتهم هذا الفرح الطفولى الذى يتميز بالتفاؤل والانفتاح على عكس الالمان المعاصرين لنيتشة حيث كان الطابع التشاؤمى والانغلاق على الذات هو المسيطر على ثقافتهم 。 。。。more

Fatima ，

Philosophical but has great moments。 Suffering is key to life。

Angela Holtz ，

A Lilac Wolf and Stuff ReviewDon't buy the Kindle version。 It quit 97 pages in。 I only know this Kindle book is buggy。Thank you for reading。 A Lilac Wolf and Stuff ReviewDon't buy the Kindle version。 It quit 97 pages in。 I only know this Kindle book is buggy。Thank you for reading。 。。。more

Arthur Gailes ，

Probably Nietzsche's worst book， but his invection against Socrates is startlingly brilliant， and not commonly summarized in profiles of him。 The Apollo/Dionysus piece， by contrast， is likewise brilliant， but better summed up in a typical encyclopedia article than it is here。 Probably Nietzsche's worst book， but his invection against Socrates is startlingly brilliant， and not commonly summarized in profiles of him。 The Apollo/Dionysus piece， by contrast， is likewise brilliant， but better summed up in a typical encyclopedia article than it is here。 。。。more

Kyleen ，

Nietzsche describes the dynamic between two central forces in tragedy: the primal， intoxicating rawness of Dionysus and the ordered beauty of Apollo。 One cannot exist without the other， i。e。 true art is a reflection of both。 What is the value of dreams and hopes if we do not acknowledge the suffering and entropy of a meaningless universe？ Without this， art is uncreative and vapid。 Accept the pain。 Affirm it。 Own it and build your dreams upon it。His writing can feel convoluted and you get the sen Nietzsche describes the dynamic between two central forces in tragedy: the primal， intoxicating rawness of Dionysus and the ordered beauty of Apollo。 One cannot exist without the other， i。e。 true art is a reflection of both。 What is the value of dreams and hopes if we do not acknowledge the suffering and entropy of a meaningless universe？ Without this， art is uncreative and vapid。 Accept the pain。 Affirm it。 Own it and build your dreams upon it。His writing can feel convoluted and you get the sense that this guy was listening to a ton of opera at the time by the way he simps for Wagner and trash talks modern aesthetics。 There’s no ignoring the irony in that he had to use a structure of rationality and “if-then’s” to conceptualize the Dionysian。 But it’s good to see his flaws and contradictions。 Overall a good intro to Nietzsche。 。。。more

Justin Barger ，

not too shabby of a book， Nietzsche explains why nature and art are quite important， dividing the lines between the Dionysian （nature） and the Appolonian （art， the highest attainment for man） and why each one compliments each other。 other than that it dragged on for quite some time and was confusive at other times but otherwise a nice compliment to "Twilight Of The Idols" not too shabby of a book， Nietzsche explains why nature and art are quite important， dividing the lines between the Dionysian （nature） and the Appolonian （art， the highest attainment for man） and why each one compliments each other。 other than that it dragged on for quite some time and was confusive at other times but otherwise a nice compliment to "Twilight Of The Idols" 。。。more

Muaz Ref ，

إن الاعتقاد بالمقدرة على فهم نيتشه تماماً اعتقاد أحمق ، نيتشه عبقري ومجنون في ذات الوقت ، قديس وشيطان ، يحمل في قلبه أعمق الأحقاد تجاه الجنس البشري ، وخالص الحب 。。 لكن قبل كل شيء نيتشه فنان في هذا العمل يمكن فهم الحجر الأساس الذي يعتمد عليه نيتشه في كل إرثه ، حتى لو تنكر للميتافيزيقيا بعد ذلك ، لكنه لم يستطع أن يتنصل أبداً من ما تعنيه في الواقع 。。。 من بوابة " علم الجمال " يبحث نيتشه في الشكل الأولي للفن في التراجيديا الإغريقية ، الباعث الأساس للفن الإنساني بوصف المسرح التراجيدي " حالة من الإغرا إن الاعتقاد بالمقدرة على فهم نيتشه تماماً اعتقاد أحمق ، نيتشه عبقري ومجنون في ذات الوقت ، قديس وشيطان ، يحمل في قلبه أعمق الأحقاد تجاه الجنس البشري ، وخالص الحب 。。 لكن قبل كل شيء نيتشه فنان في هذا العمل يمكن فهم الحجر الأساس الذي يعتمد عليه نيتشه في كل إرثه ، حتى لو تنكر للميتافيزيقيا بعد ذلك ، لكنه لم يستطع أن يتنصل أبداً من ما تعنيه في الواقع 。。。 من بوابة " علم الجمال " يبحث نيتشه في الشكل الأولي للفن في التراجيديا الإغريقية ، الباعث الأساس للفن الإنساني بوصف المسرح التراجيدي " حالة من الإغراق في الخروج من وهم العالم الواقعي بوصفه وهم يخفي الطبيعة الأصلية للوجود وتلمسه في الحالة الوجدانية الأصلية فيما قبل الشكل الحسي " تحاكي الميثالوجيا الإغريقية كمرتكز أساسي للفن الذي عرفه العالم فيما بعد " المسرح التراجيدي الإغريقي " ومن ثم تحوله أو انحداره إلى " الشكل الدرامي الحديث " قصة أصلية ، يراها نيتشه تتلخص في محور العلاقة بين إله النشوة والفوضى واللاشكل والموسيقى " ديونيسوس " ، وإله الشكل والصورة والتمظهر " أبولو " وهنا تجد العلاقة بين هذان العالمان ، عالم الرقص والنشوة والموسيقى واالاندفاع المنحل نحو الحياة بوصفها اندفاع تدميري أبدي كحقيقة أصلية （ يجب عدم الانخداع فعالم دويونيسوس لم يكن عالم فرح ، فالنشوة المعنية هنا لا نشوة تفاؤل فَرِح أحمق ، إنها نشوة الوجود ، رقصة تجمع في تتابعها حركة الولادة والموت في آنٍ معاً ） والعالم الأبولي الذي يمنح هذه الرقصة شكلها الممكن استدراكه واستيعابه في شكل الأسطورة بوصفها رحلة البطل باتجاه أقسى وأبشع آلامه （ معاناة أوديب كوصفة أولى لمعنى التراجيديا ） （ تجدر هنا الإشارة إلى قصور فهم فرويد لمعنى هذه الأسطورة ） إذا أمكن فهم هذه العلاقة ، يمكن الإجابة عن تساؤلات من مثل 。。 ما الذي يمكن أن تستوعبه من معاناة سيزيف الأبدية مع الصخرة ، كيف يمكن تصور عالم عبثي ممكن بهذا الشكل اللامنتهي ؟ لماذا لا نفهم الموسيقى " الحقيقية اللامزيفة " ورغم ذلك نقدسها كأسمى أشكال الفن ، بوصفها قوة جاذبة دافعة لكنها قدرة إمكان مجهض واستعصاء أبدي على الفهم ، أو بشكل أبسط （ شكل ما للعالم يلي شكله الأصلي ويسبق وهم الصورة الحسية ） ؟ لماذا يستمر الإنسان في العيش على الرغم من إغراقه في إدراك معاناته ، معاناة الوجود العبثي الذي ينتهي ويتلاشى ويندثر إلى الأبد ؟ ما الذي يدفع الإنسان في رحلته نحو " شكل البطل الأُسطوري " في محاولته للوجود ، على الرغم من معرفته المسبقة بأنها رحلة تدميره " إيكاريوس " ما الذي يجعل الحياة ممكنة في المتاهة ، وهل من الممكن لثيسيوس أن يتغلب على المينوتور ، أم أنه خيط أرديانيه الذي يحاول أن يوهمنا بالإمكانية ويجعلنا مقبلين دائماً على التجربة ؟ وأخيراً 。。。 يمكن اعتبار نيتشه المجنون الأول الذي أعطى شارة البدء لكل الشخصيات التاريخية المغرقة في فهم المعاناة الذاتية في العالم اليوم ، من العدميين إلى فرويد وكارل يانغ ، إلى الفن السينمائي الحديث إذ قلما تجد عمل سينمائي خالد يخلو من لوثة جنون وعبقرية نيتشه فيه 。。 في فلم 2001 A space Odyssey يحاول كوبريك تلمس البداية النيتشوية في مولد التراجيديا ، لمحاولة استيعاب رقصة الفن بين （ الديونيسي- الأبولي ） أنصح بمشاهدة الفلم مع قراءة الكتاب 。。。 <\b> 。。。more

Dan Meyer ，

I have read both Sean Whiteside （Penguin Classics） and Douglas Smith's （Oxford World's Classics） translations of *The Birth of Tragedy，* and compared both frequently to the original German — Smith's is superior， capturing Nietzsche's style more sufficiently and using language that is easier to follow。 If you read Whiteside's translation， I fear you will get lost in an already murky text。 Additionally， the Oxford World's Classics edition has significantly more robust notes and a better introducti I have read both Sean Whiteside （Penguin Classics） and Douglas Smith's （Oxford World's Classics） translations of *The Birth of Tragedy，* and compared both frequently to the original German — Smith's is superior， capturing Nietzsche's style more sufficiently and using language that is easier to follow。 If you read Whiteside's translation， I fear you will get lost in an already murky text。 Additionally， the Oxford World's Classics edition has significantly more robust notes and a better introduction。*The Birth of Tragedy* is the first major work by Friedrich Nietzsche and one of his more difficult books， emerging as it does from his work as a classical philologist and his early influence by Arthur Schopenhauer and Richard Wagner。 He departs from many of the grander ideas of this book， yet those who read it alongside his later work can see vestiges of the Apollonian and Dionysian conflict， and it is for reading his magnum opus *Thus Spoke Zarathustra* — which Paul Loeb has argued （successfully， I think） is structured like a Greek tragedy。 Given the youth of Nietzsche's thought at the time of writing， *The Birth of Tragedy* is an enduring piece of philosophy due to its sheer grandeur of vision。 That being said， if you enter it expecting it to have the same kick of *Zarathustra*， *Beyond Good and Evil*， *Genealogy of Morality*， or even *Gay Science* you will be disappointed。 It is the weakest work of a true genius， which means it is still beyond comparison to most philosophy。 。。。more

Yavuz Milar ，

The only philosopher who cares about the experience of the reader。 Most philosophy books are hard， requires attention and composure a bit of dedication but Nietzsche is something else。He has an exceptional prose， you’d think he is writing a novel or a poem。 All these fit with what he is trying to tell us。 Life needs Dionysus just like it needs Apollo。 Stop it with this Incel named Socrates。 If his philosophy of truth and logic makes him sad， just fuck him， right？ I mean why the fuck are you both The only philosopher who cares about the experience of the reader。 Most philosophy books are hard， requires attention and composure a bit of dedication but Nietzsche is something else。He has an exceptional prose， you’d think he is writing a novel or a poem。 All these fit with what he is trying to tell us。 Life needs Dionysus just like it needs Apollo。 Stop it with this Incel named Socrates。 If his philosophy of truth and logic makes him sad， just fuck him， right？ I mean why the fuck are you bothering with all this reason if all it is going to do is make your life more miserable。 All you need to realize he is correct is to pass time reading this book for an hour than try to read something like Kant or something。 Life needs pleasure， it needs a sense of action， authenticity。 We need music and dancing and so on。 So all in all he is pretty meta because his prose is also telling us his philosophy。 This guy really get it。 This is really not a scholarly book。 Heck， it is not really a philosophy book even。 But it is just great。 。。。more

Serg ，

Nietzsche’s own “Attempt at Self-Criticism”， which he appended to a revised edition of The Birth of Tragedy published in 1886， is probably still the best commentary on the original。 Here is the gist of his self-criticism: “I find it an impossible book: I consider it badly written， ponderous， embarrassing， image-mad and image-confused， sentimental， in places saccharine to the point of effeminacy， uneven in tempto， without the will to logical cleanliness…” Nietzsche does admit there is some value Nietzsche’s own “Attempt at Self-Criticism”， which he appended to a revised edition of The Birth of Tragedy published in 1886， is probably still the best commentary on the original。 Here is the gist of his self-criticism: “I find it an impossible book: I consider it badly written， ponderous， embarrassing， image-mad and image-confused， sentimental， in places saccharine to the point of effeminacy， uneven in tempto， without the will to logical cleanliness…” Nietzsche does admit there is some value in the book， in that it dared to probe into the problem of science itself， science considered as problematic and questionable。 For Nietzsche， “art， and not morality， is the truly metaphysical activity of man”， and as he is wont to repeat， “the existence of the world is justified only as an aesthetic phenomenon。” So how far does The Birth of Tragedy go in expounding on this new pessimism “beyond good and evil”？ And is there anything else of value here besides that？ For me， I still took a lot from the book。 The distinction between the Apollinian and the Dionysian is sketched vividly in the first five sections。 The Apollinian gives the most sublime expression to the individual’s unshaken faith in the principium individuationis， while the Dionysian expresses the combination of terror and ecstasy at the collapse of this principium。 And next， when Nietzsche brings up the Sacaea festival， I couldn’t help thinking that’s us today。 We are the criminal with our five days of royal rights -- right before our execution。 In Nietzsche you have a main source of many of our 20th and 21st century beacons: Joseph Campbell， Alan Watts， Jordan Peterson just to name a few。 Here is a source for Campbell and Peterson: “It is the fate of every myth to creep by degrees into the narrow limits of some alleged historical reality… This is the way in which religions are wont to die out: under the stern， intelligent eyes of an orthodox dogmatism， the mythical premises of a religion are systematized as a sum total of historical events… the feeling for myth perishes， and its place is taken by the claim of religion to historical foundations。”Here is a source for Watts: “In song and in dance man is no longer an artist， he has become a work of art: in these paroxysms of intoxication the artistic power of all nature reveals itself to the highest gratification of the primordial unity。 The noblest clay， the most costly marble， man， is here kneaded and cut。” Nietzsche finds his own first book disagreeable exactly for these kinds of images， of man the noblest clay， the most costly marble kneaded and cut through song and dance， but I find this moving。Making explicit what was so long implicit in our esoteric religion and our highest dramatic arts， Nietzsche says: “We are merely images and artistic projections for the true author， and we have our highest dignity in our significance as works of art。” What is the value of art？ Our social scientists would have you believe that art is meant to improve society and institutions。 Bloom would counter that and say high literature never improved society， it only made an individual a stronger reader， a consciousness more aware of self and others。 Nietzsche， on the other hand， is the closest to them all: “When the danger to man’s will is greatest， art approaches as a saving sorceress， expert at healing。 She alone knows how to turn these nauseous thoughts about the horror or absurdity of existence into notions with which one can live: these are the sublime as the artistic taming of the horrible， and the comic as the artistic discharge of the the nausea of absurdity。” A power that heals the nausea towards existence is indeed true power， and that’s the power of the highest art。Nietzsche proceeds to expand on the realm of poetry。 I remember once I was talking with my boss， back when I had a corporate job， about poetry。 I told him about Walt Whitman。 He had a philosophic inclination， but he dismissed poetry as mostly nonsense。 That’s how most people view not just poetry but the arts。 But， as Nietzsche says about poetry， truly the sphere of art does not lie outside the world as a fantastic impossibility spawned by the artist’s brain -- it really is the unvarnished expression of the truth。 The breadth of the book is pretty wide。 Nietzsche covers the necessity of going against nature in order to obtain her deepest secrets -- that’s what the tragedy of Oedipus covertly suggests。 I find that shockingly illuminating。 Consider marriage， a very unnatural arrangement for either sex。 For centuries this has been the norm and has helped with social stability。 But with modernity， the shackles of society， the unnatural restraints of tradition， are being loosed。 Less and less are we grappling with our own nature， and more and more are we indulging freely and going with our natural inclination。 What does that portend about the state of wisdom in our culture？ On this topic of culture， I shudder to think what Nietzsche would say about where we are today。 He’d probably find our situation unbearable。 I love Nietzsche for many reasons， but his cultural criticism is not one of them。 And yet he really is amongst the best in this regard。 In 1870 he was criticizing our higher educational institutions as “never being lower or feebler than at present。” God have mercy on the 21st century！ Next he anticipates the plight of modern man， which is the plight of mythless man。 We can have no healthy culture without myth， for myth alone guides and saves us from aimless wanderings。 Again， he writes this in 1870， but it just as perfectly describes our current God-forsaken mythless culture: “Let us ask ourselves whether the feverish and uncanny excitement of this culture is anything but the greedy seizing and snatching at food of a hungry man -- and who would care to contribute anything to a culture that cannot be satisfied no matter how much it devours， and at whose contact the most vigorous and wholesome nourishment is changed into ‘history and criticism’。” This strikes at the core of contemporary America， as if it were written today。 Nietzsche is right when he criticizes his own optimism about a rebirth。 He initially says the rebirth of Hellenism and the renovation of the German spirit （could read American or even human spirit） will eventually happen through the fire magic of music。 Well， Mr。 Nietzsche， have you heard of WAP？ Hahaha。So I agree with Nietzsche’s self-criticism， that his optimism and hope were unwarranted -- which only serves to deflate any optimism and hope for today。 And yet， the power here still remains。 I want to close off with this， one of the heights of this book， a minor glory that would only be refined and amplified in the decades to come: “We really are for a brief moment primordial being itself， feeling its raging desire for existence and joy in existence; the struggle， the pain， the destruction of phenomena， now appear to us， in view of the excess of countless forms of existence which force and push one another into life， in view of the exuberant fertility of the universal will。” 。。。more

Kevin Wilcox ，

An essential Nietzsche read， defining what became for him a critical distinction between the Appoline and the Dyonisian， the latter a concept which would become a recurring theme throughout his later， more influential works。 Otherwise disjointed， disorganized， opaque and difficult to follow， only later to be renounced by Nietzsche himself， The Birth of Tragedy is a worthwhile read for the Nietzsche scholar， yet certainly not an entry-point， nor does it contain his greatest insights。

Jason ，

Too much Dionysian， not enough Apollonian。

Nadia Ash ，

An exploration of the nature of art and tragedy， bred from the interplay of Dionysus （the god of wine， insanity and religious ecstasy） and Apollo （god of prophecy， knowledge and contemplation）， Nietzsche draws upon the history and philosophy of the Greeks， as well as Schopenhauerian thought， to produce a riveting analysis of the role of art in human life。 He explores the dialectic between these two opposing yet complementary forces of art， that of order and measured beauty， and that of chaos， un An exploration of the nature of art and tragedy， bred from the interplay of Dionysus （the god of wine， insanity and religious ecstasy） and Apollo （god of prophecy， knowledge and contemplation）， Nietzsche draws upon the history and philosophy of the Greeks， as well as Schopenhauerian thought， to produce a riveting analysis of the role of art in human life。 He explores the dialectic between these two opposing yet complementary forces of art， that of order and measured beauty， and that of chaos， unbridled and exhilaratingly free。。。 The Dionysiac side of art is， according to dear Friedrich， the essence of life itself， dazzling and terrible in its purity。 The Apolline， on the other hand， is a mere reflection， an imitation， somewhat softened and reduced to measured order。 These notions are applied to music and drama， music being the manifestation of the true nature， core and essence of life。 Though it's true that the words and visual representations of drama have their limitations， I don't think this necessarily places music at a level closer to truth， solely due to its intangibility。 Nonetheless， words will certainly never be enough to project an exact representation of a thought， a notion， all the abstractions of life。。。perhaps precisely because music is an abstraction in itself， it can indeed have the power to transcend those restrictions imposed upon words to draw us ever closer to the truth。 Or perhaps truth simply isn't compatible with human nature。。。after all， Nietzsche stresses that both Dionysus and Apollo are just as essential to life as the other; the Apolline deception can relieve us of the burden of the Dionysiac surge and excess， offering some equilibrium to the fickle scales of the human temperament。 Without the restraint offered by the Apolline， we would succumb to chaos and insanity - for this is the price of Truth。Nietzsche then launches into a denouncement of Socratic principles， claiming that he brought about the death of tragedy through valuing rationality and reason above art and chaotic creation。。。 "And here stands man， stripped of myth， eternally starving， in the midst of all the past ages， digging and scrabbling for roots， even if he must dig for them in the most remote antiquities。。。" Here， Nietzsche notes the inherently unsatisfied nature of modern culture， and our inevitable strive to reunite ourselves with myth， legend， some ancient culture which will sate our desire for the intangible， the unknowable， the ecstasy of the obliteration of all reason。。。 He calls for the rebirth of tragedy out of the snares of Socratic reason， stressing the importance of this for the elevation of German culture in a desire to reach the heights of the Greeks。"Tragedy sits in sublime rapture amidst this abundance of life， suffering and delight， listening to a far-off， melancholy song which tells of the Mothers of Being， whose names are Delusion， Will and Woe。" 。。。more

محمد المغازي ，

يعني أولا واضح فيه ارتباك في النص، وبعد سنوات هيعود نيتشه ليقره في مراجعته بعد خمستاشر سنة وهيبرره بالاندفاع والرومانسية。ثانيا المشكلة تكمن أيضا أن المسرح أصبح فن نادر وشبه منقرض وحظت السينما والدراما التلفزيونية بإرث المسرح وطبعا دي فنون رغم أنها بنت المسرح الشرعية إلا أن أدواتها مختلفة كليا و حصل تطور هائل في الأساليب أصلا يخلي كلام نيتشه أشبه بالحديث عن الديناصوروثالثا نيتشه يحاول إثبات وجهة نظره بعافية فالكتاب واضح تحيزه وعباراته متناقضة أحيانا كثيرة ونظرياته اللي بتتكرر مرة تلو الأخرى لأنه يعني أولا واضح فيه ارتباك في النص، وبعد سنوات هيعود نيتشه ليقره في مراجعته بعد خمستاشر سنة وهيبرره بالاندفاع والرومانسية。ثانيا المشكلة تكمن أيضا أن المسرح أصبح فن نادر وشبه منقرض وحظت السينما والدراما التلفزيونية بإرث المسرح وطبعا دي فنون رغم أنها بنت المسرح الشرعية إلا أن أدواتها مختلفة كليا و حصل تطور هائل في الأساليب أصلا يخلي كلام نيتشه أشبه بالحديث عن الديناصوروثالثا نيتشه يحاول إثبات وجهة نظره بعافية فالكتاب واضح تحيزه وعباراته متناقضة أحيانا كثيرة ونظرياته اللي بتتكرر مرة تلو الأخرى لأنه لا يملك غيرها。 رغم كل تلك الصعاب استمتعت بالكتاب 。。。more

Dan Raghinaru ，

Young Nietzsche appeals to Wagner， Schopenhauer， Goethe， and even to Kant in order to defend the Dionysian and the Greek tragedy against the Apollonian， Socrates， the optimism and superficiality of sciences， and so on。 The individual may try to hide behind Apollonian appearances and subterfuges， but in the end the creative destruction represented by the Dionysus will triumph in life。 The proper understanding of all that is essential in life and art should be purely aesthetic; while any ethical， Young Nietzsche appeals to Wagner， Schopenhauer， Goethe， and even to Kant in order to defend the Dionysian and the Greek tragedy against the Apollonian， Socrates， the optimism and superficiality of sciences， and so on。 The individual may try to hide behind Apollonian appearances and subterfuges， but in the end the creative destruction represented by the Dionysus will triumph in life。 The proper understanding of all that is essential in life and art should be purely aesthetic; while any ethical， logical， or scientific interpretation is just missing the point。 Nietzsche is quite verbose， passionate， and optimistic in this book。 Later Nietzsche will denounce Wagner's music， Schopenhauer's philosophy， the German culture as a whole， and this book as fundamentally romantic and decadent; while Dionysus will morph and take a clear identity as Zarathustra and/or the Antichrist。 。。。more

Ömer Talha ，

Nietzsche bizi， tragedyanın ölümünden Sokrates ile felsefenin temellerini atmaya， ardından tragedyanın yeniden doğumuna şahit olmaya davet ediyor。

Helen ，

تقریبا دو بار خوندمش و با اونکه برای فهمش به مقالات و تحلیل‌های کتاب هم مراجعه کردم فهمم از کتاب ناقصه。 ویرایش کتاب مربوط به سال ٢٠١٢ بود ولی ترجمه‌ی جالبی نداشت。

Alex Kalinske ，

Could only be better if written directly to me。

Oneeb ，

The Birth of Tragedy is divided into twenty-five chapters and a forward。 The first fifteen chapters deal with the nature of Greek Tragedy， which Nietzsche claims was born when the Apollonian worldview met the Dionysian。 The last ten chapters use the Greek model to understand the state of modern culture， both its decline and its possible rebirth。 Nietzsche forms a very strict definition of art that excludes such things as subjective self-expression and the opera。 Despite his criticisms of human The Birth of Tragedy is divided into twenty-five chapters and a forward。 The first fifteen chapters deal with the nature of Greek Tragedy， which Nietzsche claims was born when the Apollonian worldview met the Dionysian。 The last ten chapters use the Greek model to understand the state of modern culture， both its decline and its possible rebirth。 Nietzsche forms a very strict definition of art that excludes such things as subjective self-expression and the opera。 Despite his criticisms of human culture， however， Nietzsche has great faith in the human soul and urges us to drop our Socratic pretenses and accept the culture of Dionysus again。Nietzsche describes the state of Greek art before the influence of Dionysus as being naive， and concerned only with appearances。 In this art conception， the observer was never truly united with art， as he remained always in quiet contemplation with it， never immersing himself。 （Mentioned in Genealogy of Morals as well， the purpose of art is to evoke emotions in a person， not calm him down）The appearances of Apollo were designed to shield man from the innate suffering of the world， and thus provide some relief and comfort。Then came Dionysus， whose ecstatic revels first shocked the Apollonian man of Greek culture。 In the end， however， it was only through one's immersion in the Dionysian essence of Primordial Unity that redemption from the suffering of the world could be achieved。 In Dionysus， man found that his existence was not limited to his individual experiences alone， and thus a way was found to escape the fate of all men， which is death。 As the Dionysian essence is eternal， one who connects with this essence finds a new source of life and hope。 Nietzsche thus shows Dionysus to be an uplifting alternative to the salvation offered by Christianity， which demands that man renounce life on earth altogether and focus only on heaven。 For， in order to achieve salvation through Dionysus， one must immerse oneself in life now。Music exists in the realm beyond language， and so allows us to rise beyond consciousness and experience our connection to the Primordial Unity。 Music is superior to all other arts in that it does not represent a phenomenon， but rather the "world will" itself。The time is ripe for a rebirth of tragedy that will sweep away the dusty remains of Socratic culture。 Nietzsche sees German music， Wagner in particular， as the beginning of this transformation。 Richard Wagner says that art， not morality is the metaphysical human activity which defines the existence of world。In conclusion， Birth of tragedy happens when it's recognised that world and life cannot give meaningful satisfactions to a person。 The answer lies in evading Apollonian worldview （primitive， over- protective and evangelical） and adopting Dionysian mindset （emotions， feelings triggered through art， music and living now in the moment）。 。。。more

Juanso ，

Leer esto se siente como escalar un monte consciente de ti。 El monte te hace la subida más difícil a propósito。 Piensas que es por joder， pero lo hace realmente para que tengas una mejor experiencia。 Acabas en la cima e igual lo único que hizo eso fue joder en fin。Las notas añadidas al final （leí la versión disponible en Proyecto Gutenberg） son excelentes。

V。 ，

Why can people write great rock on LSD， but not great novels？ What makes the Phantom Menace opening crawl so much worse than the one in A New Hope？ Is the audience really supposed to "project themselves" onto a Greek chorus？All this and more， as they say。 I don't agree with every idea in here， but there are plenty to choose from， and all at least thought-provoking。 Also gorgeously written。 Why can people write great rock on LSD， but not great novels？ What makes the Phantom Menace opening crawl so much worse than the one in A New Hope？ Is the audience really supposed to "project themselves" onto a Greek chorus？All this and more， as they say。 I don't agree with every idea in here， but there are plenty to choose from， and all at least thought-provoking。 Also gorgeously written。 。。。more

Reference

google book https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&q=The Birth of Tragedy

hathitrust digital library https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/ls?q1=The Birth of Tragedy&field1=ocr&a=srchls&ft=ft&lmt=ft

The British Library https://bll01.primo.exlibrisgroup.com/discovery/search?query=any,contains,The Birth of Tragedy&tab=LibraryCatalog&search_scope=Not_BL_Suppress&vid=44BL_INST:BLL01&lang=en&offset=0